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frustrated 3rd time failed
Last Post 08/02/2019 3:38 AM by yash basi
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04/14/2013 9:01 PM
Author: ana [21813]
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So I have a dilemma and need advice. I first took the Illinois Bar Exam in February 2012 failed it. My essays are great the MBE kills me every time. For the Feb 2012 my MBE raw score was 98. Than re-took the bar exam in July 2012 my MBE raw score was 112 (failed the bar by 3 points). Than took it again Feb 2013- failed again my MBE raw score was 98 once again. I am very frustrated have no idea what my problem is with the MBE. I know all my rules I know the substantive I guess my issue is application. I have done barbri and I have used adaptibar & lawpreps. I am at a lost I don't know how to beat the MBE. I am registering to take the exam again in July. (This exam has cost me so much money it is ridiculous)....Anyone have any tips/recommendations on how to beat the freakin MBE?!!? Any help is appreciated.

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04/14/2013 11:54 PM
Author: imo [21813]
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kaplan pmbr

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04/15/2013 1:01 AM
Author: RT [21813]
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Ana,

Also look into Jason Tolerico's "Best MBE" online program. Excellent program and very affordable.

Don't give up! You're very close to passing if you failed by only 3 points. Good luck to you.

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04/15/2013 2:10 AM
Author: tip [21813]
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Hi,

I have a feeling you are picking the next best answer. Have you tried picking your second guess and seeing if this brings your score up?

What topics are your lowest? Contracts and Property?


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04/15/2013 9:04 AM
Author: Sean [21813]
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I understand how it might come across to promote yourself, but I've written quite a lot about strategy on my blog, and I think those posts might help you. It's at http://www.mbetutorial.blogspot.com, and there is a label for strategy posts.

Hope it helps!

Best,

Sean

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04/15/2013 9:05 AM
Author: Sean [21813]
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04/15/2013 3:47 PM
Author: ana [21813]
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my only weak subject is property.

Thank You to those that have responded.

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04/16/2013 7:27 AM
Author: JJMAN [21813]
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The only way I could conquer the MBE was 1500+ practice questions under time constraints. Eventually, the patterns and rules become redundant. Work drills every day of 20-30 questions and have days where you do 60-80 and at least one simulated test with 200. I was getting 40-50% in the beginning and by the end of bar prep 60-70%, which is where you need to be.

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04/16/2013 9:25 AM
Author: anon [21813]
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The same strategy worked for me after having failed 3 times. I used adaptibar, did over 1,700 questions, two full practice MBE's and consistently reviewed my wrong answers. Near exam time I was getting 75% + correct. I believe passing is also a huge mental thing that you have to see yourself doing... If you keep doing the same thing to study you'll continue failing.

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04/17/2013 7:19 AM
Author: FLA Taker [21813]
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Look at your scores and see if the Board in your State breaks down each subject for you so that you can see your weakest subject areas.
For example: out of 30 contracts questions, you answered only 10 correctly. Focus on those weak subjects first!!!
When I took the Bar for the first time and failed, I looked at my MBE scores and said to myself, "its like I wasn't even there?!" - I got a 9 out of 30 on property on the MBE. Property was one of my best classes in law school. I just kept wondering what the hell happened? What was I missing or not doing?
This time around, I didn't listen to any lectures. I did TONS of practice questions. That's ALL I did. I thought I practiced enough questions the first time around, and failed. This time around, I know what practice really means. After you do enough questions, you really do see some type of pattern. At least, in the answer choices. If two out of four are basically saying the same thing, then you know none of those can be the correct answer.
I think you're right about you're weakness being in application, not in knowledge or substance. Because you passed the State portion of your Bar, which I think is more difficult because it is always so subjective and you never know what they're going to ask, you obviously know your stuff. Look at it this way: this time around you only have to study half of the material as before and you definitely know what to expect.
Again, with your weakness (like mine) being in application and analysis, the absolute most important thing is PRACTICE!!! Questions, questions and more questions! Read the explanations, write down any different rules you come across because more likely than not, you'll encounter that rule again. Spend 95% of your study time in July doing practice questions and you WILL pass the MBE
Have faith. This journey we've all chosen is so incredibly difficult in every way. Don't give up! I was ready to throw in the towel because I was so exhausted and frustrated with the whole thing and now, I am so happy I kept going. It WILL pay off in the end and you will reach all of your goals! My Prayers and Thoughts are with everyone who has to fight this battle again in July. I'm pulling for all of you.

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04/17/2013 7:58 AM
Author: Dinkamoe [21813]
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Practice MBE questions, read ALL answer explanations, which means read the answers to the ones you got right also, chose the BEST answer (Rocky road over ice cream).

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04/23/2013 2:14 PM
Author: eyelandgurl [21813]
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http://www.barexamstrategy.com/substance2.html

I can't tell you enough great things about this guy. He will help you pass. I failed 3 times and went to him and passed. He is in DC but he tutors folks from other states. His material alone will help you pass if you study the material and practice, practice, practice. Good luck!

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04/25/2013 1:54 PM
Author: Bud Fox [21813]
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Clearly, you need to stop taking the California Bar, move to another state, and take the Bar there.

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04/26/2013 3:39 PM
Author: cupcake [21813]
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Ana -
Go to your state's board of law examiners website and look for a waiver of fees form. They should have one and you can request a waiver of the re-application fee.

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05/03/2013 8:17 AM
Author: ana [21813]
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Lol ive been taking the Illinois bar not the California lol.

Anyone have a suggestion which program has great mbe questions & feedback? Adaptibar or the best mbe?

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05/03/2013 8:54 AM
Author: 3rd time passer [21813]
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I used Barbri twice and although I did very well on the practice tests, I failed the TX Bar twice. On the 3rd try, I tried Themis and that program was great. I also supplemented with the Strategies and Tactics Book and I would highly recommend doing the questions on the actual NCBE website. I finally passed changing my studying strategy.

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05/03/2013 9:53 AM
Author: Daves1 [21813]
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Here is a simple tip I read online that I believe helped me a LOT on the February MBE (146.9 scaled)... Do as many practice questions as you can (obviously), and keep a running list of the rule statements for the ones you get wrong, and then review that over and over in the last couple of weeks.

So as I was doing my practice MBEs, for the ones I got wrong, I just typed the rule on my running list. By the end, I had a Word document full of bullet-points (one or two sentences each) about 5 or 6 pages, and spent a lot of time reading through it, at least once a day. There were definitely at least a few MBE questions that I got right because I remembered it from my list.

Good luck.

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05/03/2013 10:49 AM
Author: MBE experience [21813]
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I just passed on my 3rd time. Here is how I studied:

1st time: Did BarBri lectures and about half of the m/c questions in the books. MBE 127

2nd time: Studied Barbri Lectures, did the entire AMP program, did ALL online Barbri questions (where I consistently ranked in the top 75% as compared to all others doing the same questions). Still failed!!! MBE 125

3rd time: Used BarBri materials. Read Conviser cover-to-cover. Dug deep into the MS outlines, and into the state specific books. Also, made a about 800 flashcards over my weaker subjects. I did NOT study ANY m/c questions until about two weeks before the exam. Then, I did about 500 m/c out of the BarBri books (did the ones that were marked the most challenging). I did enough m/c questions to refresh myself on spotting the tricks etc. This time PASSED MBE 140


Know black letter law cold. The problem with studying m/c questions is that

Remember, BarBri DOES NOT use past MBE questions … they write their own materials. In my experience, the MBE changes up every exam cycle to keep people guessing. The was obviously different for the past three exams (I should know). The bar examiners know that we study Barbri and other test prep programs.

My suggestion is to study bar prep course m/c questions ONLY to learn the tricks and pitfalls of m/c questions. The other issue is that when you study m/c questions, you are just getting snippets of the law here and there; it’s not coming together in your head in a connected and coherent format. You need to learn the law cold and in a structured way so it’s easy to recall and apply.

This is what worked for me.

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05/03/2013 12:44 PM
Author: The Impossible Princess Magdalena [21813]
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Ana,

If Black Letter law is your problem I recommend "Multistate Question & Answer Volumes" by Dion Sullivan. I do not discount what others are saying but there is nothing better for Black Letter Law than his books for the MBE. My friend passed on her 4th time using these books and I passed on my 7th try. If she hasn't thrown them I away, I can mail them to you gratis. She and I just passed the Bar. Let me know via this thread if you are interested.


http://www.barexamstrategy.com/ordernow.html

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05/03/2013 8:43 PM
Author: Dr. Juris [21813]
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My advice is to not only take the practice tests, but to read every answer (regardless of whether you answered correctly or incorrectly) and write down the rules of law and exceptions that you encounter EACH TIME. Yes, it will take time. No, you might not be able to do eleventy billion of them, BUT it will ensure that you are actually performing the questions and analyzing why you got the answer correct or incorrect. This is pivotal, in my opinion.

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05/03/2013 10:45 PM
Author: crazzzzzylawlaw [21813]
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My MBE this time (the second time, scaled 147) was benefited from self-reorganized barbri lecture materials for the BIG SIX subjects. I kinda following my own logic pattern to rewrote an outline which later supplemented by the rules of most frequent tricks on practice questions and recited them over and over again (for at least 6 or 7 times).

Yes, there are at least 10 questions on the actual exams struck me like total strangers, but most of the questions could be covered by the Big letter rules in handout materials.

With repetitive rule memorizing, 1200+questions and a little bit luck, you will nail it this July I am sure.

You can do it!!!!!

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05/04/2013 12:21 AM
Author: Matt [29]
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I completely agree it is important to review the explanations for all practice MBE questions, not just the ones you get wrong. Although the process seems to take forever, you have plenty of time before the exam.

If you wanted to try something different to break up your routine, take one full day and read through ONLY the explanations of 2 to 3 full MBE exams. Ignore the questions completely. Why? Because you will not only learn relevant black letter law, but you will also learn what points of law the ncbx test most frequently. You can get through 400-600 MBE explanations in a day. Then, you can go back later and take the exam normally. Because you never looked at the actual questions, the exam will still be new to you, but your knowledge of the applicable black letter law will be readily available in your mind. It's a great way to solidify heavily tested concepts.

Just to clarify, I mean that you should read through the "statement of law" portion of the explanation, not the part that addresses the question itself.

It is very rewarding to plow through that many "questions" (explanations) in a day. It may sound a little weird, but it's a very useful strategy to mix in with the rest of your study regimen.

Good luck preparing for July! You are certainly in the right place for great advice and support.

Matt

http://www.leansheets.com

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05/04/2013 7:47 AM
Author: Dear Ana [21813]
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Hi Ana,

I failed NY July 2012 bar because of bad mbe, and I made it Feb 2013 with score of 143. Here is how I prepared for the second attempt:
I started with the Barbri MPQ 1 questions. I did the shorter volume of Strategies and Tactics (S&T). Then I bought an used set of pmbr (red and blue book) and did all the questions there, 50 questions per day (under time constraint). I moved on to Barbri MPQ 2 and did some of the questions there too. I also did Online Practice Exam (OPE) on NCBE site (they are great!). For every question I got wrong, I wrote out the subtle point that I missed/didn't know in flash cards. I went back to the questions that I got wrong a week later and did them again.It may sound too grinding but I did so nonetheless because my feeling was that the mbe questions are so nuianced that learning the plain rules and substance was never enough. I had to learn and memorize the fine points and detailed versions of the rules and substance. Like many suggestions above, I believe doing as many questions as possible and learning (and memorizing) the subtle nuiance is the best way to beat mbe. For me, learning the law by reading the outlines over and over again didn't help much. I totally agree with the notion that reading outlines is passive learning, and doing questions is the active learning which matters the most. We all know how frustrating it is to prepare for the bar exam, especially for the repeaters. I am sure you will make it this July. All the best of luck to you!

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05/04/2013 9:07 AM
Author: kremer [21813]
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Barbri lectures w/ 1000 Qs of pmbr + 200 Qs of barbri = 147.3 MBE

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05/04/2013 5:39 PM
Author: everyone is helping Ana [21813]
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How many of you want to do her?

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05/06/2013 8:27 AM
Author: Frustrado [21813]
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Hi Impossible Princess Magdalena,
I am Ana's twin. I too have failed 3 times. In Feb 2013 missed by 8 points (256 need 264) In Feb 2012 missed by 14, and prior to that by 21. I am improving but the MBE scaled varies from 96-115, can not seem to get to 132 scaled. I have decided to take Jul 2013 and now IL has raised the threshold from 264 to 268.
I have done Bar/Bri twice redoing all lectures, doing all the study smart Q's both times (apprx 2400 Q's) Adaptibar and PMBR completing 1200-1500, and I am still 55-60% success range. What next ! I feel soooo frustrated and completely spent. Is there a computer based program or any suggestions you have?

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05/06/2013 9:16 AM
Author: The Impossible Princess Magdalena [21813]
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^^^^^^^^^^
Well, again, if mi Amiga has not tossed the books I noted by Mr. Sullivan I could send them your way. Let me know if you want them and I'll ask her if she still has them. If you do want them, simply list your city and state here so if I give out my email address here I actually send the books to you and not someone claiming to be you.

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05/06/2013 8:17 PM
Author: Frustrado [21813]
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Hi Impossible Pprincess Magdalena,
Yes very interested please contact tu amiga a ver,.te lo agredeceria. Much appreciated.
I live in a NW Suburb and work in the city. You can reach me via telephone listed below or text me you contact info which ever you feel most comfortable with. siete setenta tres. tres seis ocho cinquenta uno quince. Thank you.

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05/07/2013 8:44 AM
Author: frustrado [21813]
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hi impossible princess magdalena,
live in chgo, il.

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05/07/2013 1:15 PM
Author: Impossible Princess Magdalena [21813]
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impossibleprincessmagdalena@gmail.com

OK - email me an address and the books are yours.

Cheerio.

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04/11/2019 1:26 PM
Author: Alllaw [21813]
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Hi,

I was wondering if you could share with me about your experience with Dion Sullivan’s tutoring service, please? Does he review and discuss essays with you as he mentioned on his website?

Thanks!

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04/12/2019 2:04 PM
Author: marioskid [3]
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04/13/2019 12:06 PM
Author: Pass? [21813]
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Did you pass or are you dead?

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05/26/2019 5:18 PM
Author: Futurelawyer2 [21813]
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My best advice to you, and to everyone else, who is sitting for the upcoming bar exam is to purchase critical pass mbe flashcards. They are inexpensive, easy to carry around and will help you with a much higher - hopefully passing score. Everyone I know who purchased them passed their respective bar exams. They really make memorization much more doable and easy.

I attached a 10% off discount below and free shipping as well.

http://criticalpass.refr.cc/barpass

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05/27/2019 3:10 PM
Author: obvious spam-bot is obvious [21813]
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Posted By Anonymous on 05/26/2019 5:18 PM
My best advice to you, and to everyone else, who is sitting for the upcoming bar exam is to purchase critical pass mbe flashcards. They are inexpensive, easy to carry around and will help you with a much higher - hopefully passing score. Everyone I know who purchased them passed their respective bar exams. They really make memorization much more doable and easy.

I attached a 10% off discount below and free shipping as well.

http://criticalpass.refr.cc/barpass
[/quote)


OP was from 2013 spamie, in case you were too busy spamming to notice. Thats pushing a decade brother.

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08/02/2019 3:38 AM
Author: yash basi [2]
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Hey, I am looking for a dedicated study partner for BAR. I have put my profile and study schedule on SPAM. All my friends use it to find study buddies for BAR test.

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